Car won’t start, need help

[Dme109]

My 2012 5 speed won’t start. I have tried checking the fuses and relays and I made sure that the starter was getting power. Does anyone have any ideas about what I should do before replacing the starter.

 

[scotman]

You are not giving us much information to work with. What has lead you to think that replacing the starter motor is a possible fix?
Have you seen any mil appear and then go away? Or, has the car had any strange issues like a cranking to start but the engine stalled immediately after it fired? Or even maybe you were driving at a steady speed and then the engine suddenly lost power and then regained power? I really don’t know where to go with the information given at this point.

 

[Handy Andy]

You have a 5-speed manual, (Correct?) so the Starter uses the Clutch, so look to where the Clutch pedal is, it rests on a switch, and it also has another switch all the way towards the backside of the clutch pedal as it travels all the way down.

To start the car, you'll need to pay attention to the message display in the Center console...

You may need to replace a switch or reattach a switch back onto it's holder if it's fallen off.

Turn the Key on - to START and hold it there - see if it (Console message) says, Press Clutch - or does it say Press Clutch and Brake?

IF you have the message that says to "press Clutch" - the pedal is not reaching far enough - that back side switch behind the clutch pedal is either not working - broken or it's dislodged - off it's stay - in that holder position - so it's plunger can't go down into the switch to start it.

If it says to Press Brake and Clutch or Press Clutch and Brake (either way) the plunger that anticipates action is not working - and may be out of position - or its plunger is stuck.

Ok, turn off the car and investigate that clutch pedal.

The Manual system in the Fiesta needs these two switches to work in order to start by using just the Clutch - else you'll have to press Brake pedal and Clutch to get it to start.

Get back with us on the results of this - what messages do you get?

 

[Handy Andy]

Also - to add in...Did you check the condition of the Battery?

It's cables?

(Oh sure they may look good, I mean look closely)

IF you have not had any service done to the battery - best to wear gloves to protect yourself - or have it towed to a mechanic that can handle the acid and disposal of that old battery.

Does anyone have any ideas about what I should do before replacing the starter.

It's not the best way to approach a mess like this is to presume to just drop in a new starter - the starter systems in these vehicles are quite different from the older days. To have them fail - means you'll have to tear apart some pretty big areas of wiring and parts to drop the starter and swap in a new one - but even doing that is no guarantee let alone you've re-hooked up all the parts and wires to make it work.

The PCM controls the Starter system - you just have to tell it to start, using the Key, or button - either way, the PCM checks the system, and sends a "Start" signal thru Relays and the solenoid on the starter - and only cranks for so long until specific conditions are met - you'll see those wink out on the Pods as the systems "wake up" and start the car for you.

To me, the reasons "starter" doesn't work, is more closer to a bad battery and corroded cables, than to presume the starter is "bad" - there are systems the PCM controls to do that for you as a means to protect the vehicle and you from having failed systems - a bad wire though, can cause you to think that it' is a bad starter when its just a battery cable or a connection that has failed and you just need to clean the corrosion off of it and re-establish the contacts so the PCM can tell the Starter to turn over.

So, did you get a tester yet?

These threads might provide some direction to help you find quirky connectors...
https://www.fordfiesta.org/threads/body-control-modual.8227/post-20339
https://www.fordfiesta.org/threads/help.8317/post-21317
https://www.fordfiesta.org/threads/windshield-washer-issue.7786/post-25911

 

[Dme109]

Also - to add in...Did you check the condition of the Battery?

It's cables?

(Oh sure they may look good, I mean look closely)

IF you have not had any service done to the battery - best to wear gloves to protect yourself - or have it towed to a mechanic that can handle the acid and disposal of that old battery.




It's not the best way to approach a mess like this is to presume to just drop in a new starter - the starter systems in these vehicles are quite different from the older days. To have them fail - means you'll have to tear apart some pretty big areas of wiring and parts to drop the starter and swap in a new one - but even doing that is no guarantee let alone you've re-hooked up all the parts and wires to make it work.

The PCM controls the Starter system - you just have to tell it to start, using the Key, or button - either way, the PCM checks the system, and sends a "Start" signal thru Relays and the solenoid on the starter - and only cranks for so long until specific conditions are met - you'll see those wink out on the Pods as the systems "wake up" and start the car for you.

To me, the reasons "starter" doesn't work, is more closer to a bad battery and corroded cables, than to presume the starter is "bad" - there are systems the PCM controls to do that for you as a means to protect the vehicle and you from having failed systems - a bad wire though, can cause you to think that it' is a bad starter when its just a battery cable or a connection that has failed and you just need to clean the corrosion off of it and re-establish the contacts so the PCM can tell the Starter to turn over.

So, did you get a tester yet?

These threads might provide some direction to help you find quirky connectors...
https://www.fordfiesta.org/threads/body-control-modual.8227/post-20339
https://www.fordfiesta.org/threads/help.8317/post-21317
https://www.fordfiesta.org/threads/windshield-washer-issue.7786/post-25911

When I try to start the car I do not have any messages about the clutch or brake. I am getting a code P0458 when I scan the car. I have checked and the battery is good, the reason that I thought starter is that when I turn the key all the electronics come on but the car doesn’t even attempt to crank. However I will look to see if the cables are good.

 

[Dme109]

By bypassing the battery and cables I got the engine to crank once.

 

[Handy Andy]

Wow, the cables need to be pulled and checked - they may have "broken" open, much like a fusible link - in the wire cable itself.

The big red cable that is bolted to a stud on the Battery terminal box, also has a Fuse of 450 Amps - so if something went wrong - that fuse may need to be checked - it's older so if the Fuse "seal" to encase the link used to hold the current thru it until it pops, that may cause the Fuse to open as a fail condition.

That "check" is where those (Sharp) probe point testers come in handy - fo "backprobe" thru the insulation - and see if current goes thru the cable down to the stud terminal at the solenoid.

You have a 5-speed so you should be able to "push start it" by popping the clutch.

It sounds like to me, if the Solenoid is bad, it has to use the "Big cable" to suck in the starter cog - so if no click, but the lights are there, the main harness at the battery - it seems to be ok, the Start signal" from the PCM though - you'll have to track that down and see if a Relay in the Fuse Box in the bay can be felt "ticking" - then the Start Signal is getting there and thee Relay is responding to it.

The Starter - just to replace it, might be an 1~2 hour job depending on how much is in there you have to peel away to get at it.

 

[Dme109]

UPDATE: it’s the starter. Everything was doing what it needed to do and when I checked power was getting to the starter when you cranked it BUT….. the starter was not doing what it should. Replaced it late last night and fired right up. Thanks everyone for you input and help on this. I learned a lot.